maybe combine two of your russ's into a squadron, then add at least two hydra flak tanks in a squadron. thats only 150 points and with all the skimmers and bikes in the game, the hydra takes away the turbo save.

Then I would consider dumping one of the primaris psykers and adding a squad of 5 ogryn in a chimera

if you don't want to lose the primaris maybe take a Pysker battle squad in a chimera with 8 pyskers
then you would still have some points left over for some other toys

My only point regarding outflank is that the Valkyrie doesn't give a squad scout/infiltrate... so your vets without those skills cannot outflank... though since your penal legions have it they most certainly can inside your Valkyrie, unless they have an attached independent character.

You seem to lack long range anti-tank, or the ability to deploy those veterans effectively, anybody who wants to protect thier armour will definately target those 2 valkyries early, and since your relying on a cover save of 4+ to keep them going your in for a world of hurt if they die. As an eldar player I know, though we have an upgrade that allows our tanks to just land if immobilized... yours will crash and potentially leave your squad stranded.

Mech eldar will outmanuver you, and fire more effectively than you do... your tanks battle cannons are just strength 8, 1 dice for damage against wave serpents, and tau can definately take apart a few vehicles(and remove your cover save with pathfinders) in a single turn of shooting. Assault terminators are a nasty piece of work, and your gonna see a bunch of them. Drop pods. I love them(I know i'm biased here) but your list is the kind of list a drop pod heavy army loves to see. Either you deploy something and we send cheap dreadnoughts w/ multi-meltas at it, or you reserve everything and hope that your outflaking units are able to reach objectives in time. Orcs will definately be hard army to play against if they close the distance on those russes... and with 100 boyz or so they tend too.

It really depends on what you want to do with your army. I'd definately add some long range firepower and consider the benifit of the infantry platoon.... 55 guys as a single troops choice is great, especially with orders. Your not taking advantage of the best thing about the Imperial Guard, the lowly guardsmen. When bolstered with orders they become much better, and even marines have to watch out for 100 guardsmen or more in 1500 pts.

And if you think a gun line can't win in 5th play against a guard player all in chimeras with his heavy weapons all firing out the top hatch. They'll outshoot you for sure, and be able to advance pretty handily in the 4th and 5th turns to take some objectives. Not too mention using flamers from the top hatch on your penal legion squads... who can't really hurt the chimera at all. A bunch of armies can still build a gunline and do well, as long as they are able to either redeploy or have units that can just contest the objectives they don't want to bother with.

I hate to pick at things, but as a person who played guard for years I can tell you that the secret to winning with them in infantry, the more the better. 100+ models in 1500 pts isn't a bad start. Tanks and skimmers are cool, but they don't win you games. Your troops do, and you've only got 60 of them, and since they rely on a 5+ save they tend to die quickly. Lowly guardsmen with a lot of heavy weapons can really be a nasty prospect for most players out there.

Anyways, I hope this helps out. Cheers, and best of luck with the guardsmen.

Ha! That's nice... and I'll even bite. I agree with your point regarding Land Speeder Storm and scouts. I'd even agree with your point on the drop pods if they didn't have a description to the contrary in thier unit entry in codex space marines. The drop pod doesn't have "deep strike", it enters play using "drop pod assault" which uses the rules for deep strike.... It's like a special kind of deep strike, one that I always use regardless of mission being played, not "true" deep strike like in the case of terminators, which is covered in the rulebook. If they wanted it to just "deep strike" they'd have given it that rule in it's entry, not a whole new rules set instead.

What about a unit with scout/infiltrate in a tank without? Can may scouts give it to a land raider just by staying in reserve deployed in it, choosing to outflank? Why not, if the tank grants outflank why not the unit? Why do characters like Kor'sarro Khan, who grant outflank only give it to "dedicated transports" and not all units like the raiders?

As for your independent characters joining a unit with scout/infiltrate that unit will loose scout/infiltrate if the character doesn't also have it. This is covered in the universal special rules section of the rulebook.

I'd like to point out that unless my oponent is a complete idiot I'd let him outflank with whatever unit he wanted to, especially in this case where you'd be putting both your anti-tank units in reserve, which is preferable to most players. Not everybody would, as this is not covered in the main rulebook(as no transports had scout/infiltrate/outflank at the time of it's writing)and I can't say I blame them. Just making a point regarding how things tend to be in competitive play, I'm sorry if I touched a sore spot here. If you think people aren't argumentitive look at the number of 3rd/4th ED codex players with stupid RAW.. like deathrollers.

You posted your list here for constructive critism... if you want me to say "Hey, best list ever. I think I'll go out and buy that!" just say so. Don't post your list if you don't want people to post thier thoughts on it. That's the whole idea behind "constructive critism". As for helping out with your list, which was the whole idea behind even posting:

Outflank frankly sucks unless it's on an assault unit like stealers, or bikers who are fast enough to keep pace when they arrive, or turbo-boost if they come in on the wrong side.

I also strongly dislike Valkyries. 130 points in your case for what? AV12, no fire points(which with 3 melta-guns inside would help) and 5 shots per turn. 2 chimeras with multi/heavy bolter/heavy stubber are AV12, 5 fire points(move 12" and fire melta-guns another 12") and 9 shots per turn stationary, 6 if moving 6 inches... which is better? Just have to have them outflank? Take Al-rahem and equip his squad or infantry squads with chimeras(and as dedicated transports they CLEARLY get outflank as in the rules). By the way, why outflank without the astropath to help you get them when you need them?

When I post a list I expect people to break it apart so I can see where I need to improve. When you always play at the same hobby center you play against the same armies, and getting a different point of view is key when building a competitive list for use in tournaments... otherwise you'll find you don't like that army you spent a lot of time and money on.

Anyways, forget I said anything... other than I'd love to play you sometime... bring that list if you don't mind.

I will conceed that the concept of standing and shooting with everything to win games is dead. That being said, my Eldar is heavy mech/gun line. It revolves around a fire base of dark reapers, 2 units of war walkers with eldar missile launchers/scatter lasers and wave serpents with very specific aspect warriors. It does well as it rarely moves in the first few turns, instead sending 60+ shots per turn in 1500 pts across the board. I can turbo boost mid game to secure objectives with the dire avengers, while fortune/vectored engines helps my fire dragons reach armour if needed. While not a "true gun line" it is very much one with added mobility, and has tabled more than 1 plague marine/dark eldar and space marine army in recent games.

Outflanking forces are only effective very specifically. I have seen the dual autarch, all grav tank list with scorpions all reserved. Arrives on turn 2 on a 2+ with the autarchs, and the multiple units outflanking help mitigate poor roles. Lets you come in where and when you need to for the most part, but being "elite" can be very small and sometimes outclassed.

Now, back to the main topic here... mobile guard done well. One concept that a friend of mine has used is the "drive by", the idea of using your cheap chimera to move around the board, shooting your heavy flamer/melta-gun veterans out the top while never getting out. Your troopers control/contest from the hull of the tank, and basically anything not strength 6 or very mobile can't harm your armour 12 wall to the front. Everything from all heavy bolter devastators to shooty carnifexes will be greatly reduced. Chimera's are only 55 points, and if you've got points I'd add the heavy stubber only for the extra mobile firepower. While being shaken prevents the guys inside from firing, they can get out and fire all they want... it's only when they remain "embarked" that they can't fire. Just move 12" and pop out.

Keeping pace with your tanks is needed, and leman russes are good with long range main guns. I've always loved Griffon mortars, being 75 points, big blast strength 6/AP4 and with the ability to re-roll the scatter. Marines will go down to that much strength 6 firepower, especially with a pair just lobbing shells. They can effectively hid behind your chimeras with no real loss of accuracy.

There are lots of units in your book that are great, like Strakken, Ogryns used right, Ratlings, ect. Punisher with Pask will take out a daemon prince in 1 round of shooting... even a wraithlord will be making saves against all that strength 5 shots when the re-roll to wound comes in... AND +1 to pen means your 29 shots can glance armour 12.

Just remember that you need to outnumber marines(which is the list that most people balance against) 3 to 1 to be effective in the "take and hold" way of war... basically being able to hold those precious objectives. Now, you can run less if your heavy mech, as those bolters can't really touch a chimera, but 100+ guardsmen in 1500-1850 is really the benchmark, unless your VERY good at your list.... I've been told that 26 aspect warriors in 1850 is bad, but I seem to do ok :)

Anyways, I'm not trying to "crap" on your list, just pointing out what I think regarding your outflank interpritation. I could very well be wrong, though I think I'm not(I do that alot)... but like Greg pointed out, if it is illegal, or not CLEAR people will argue. I'd hate to have it come down to a dice roll regarding whose right. Also, it comes down to what you like to play, and what you own. Sometimes it's not worth buying 10 chimeras or drop pods, ect, just to have a better list.